Dialogues At The End Of The Search
"Who or What is God" (Chapter 48)
EM: In your responses to questions about God you’ve been saying God is here, everywhere, and so there’s no need to search for Him. Well, my search was about my not being able to believe in or experience a God either “out there somewhere” or as everything there is.
It sounds like to you that’s a given - deeper than belief - but if I were to try to get there, from where I am, it seems like I’d just be chasing another belief. My view right now is just really vague and on good days pretty much embraces and welcomes all possible realities without knowing what of it all is true. I do have a sense that there is some unifying “something,” but I wouldn’t even feel able to say that “it” radiates the love that I tap into when I feel that connection; it might just as well have come from me - and that’s God, too, right? But my separated self doesn’t think so. Even with this unsettledness, I’ve never been happier or more at peace. I know I’m in the right place.
Wayne: You hit at the heart of the confusion, which is basically this: if God is everywhere all the time, why don’t I feel it or know it? It is a question that most often gets asked in religious/spiritual (RS) circles. First off, people associate feelings and emotions with God. We speak of God and love and associate them. We say, “God is love.” For us love is associated with feelings and emotions. We say we are “in love,” when we begin a relationship with someone such as a future spouse or lover. We know what that feeling is like. At a young age when we first begin to feel the pull of love, we know how overpowering it can be. We usually marry because we love someone, and we get divorced because love has flown away.
We then look for love again and often find it and the cycle begins again. When we have children we love them, and although the experience of raising a child can be very trying we put up with it because they are “ours” and we love them. But parent and child often have separations and love seems to be gone even from this most close relationship. In other words, children are no guarantee that what we call love will last. But love in our society and culture is celebrated in song and verse. It is the emotion held up as the highest we are capable of. The word “love” brings with it a reverence and it is naturally attached to God.
God is seen as the ultimate love. We are taught that God loves us and therefore we must love God. Religion and or spiritual (RS) organizations step in with this concept and build on it. It begins the conditioning that something must be done in this relationship. RS teaches that one must commune or “reach for” God-love. One must worship and praise God because He is the “source” of all and we should be grateful for his generosity.
In ages past, people (usually children) were sacrificed to this God to appease him, so that he would know we feared him and consequently he would smile on us and treat us kindly. Today, sacrifice is not practiced (except for animals, which are still routinely sacrificed); but we still give tithes to the church - a material form of sacrifice. We also sacrifice in ways that are not obvious, such as sacrificing time to go to church and to do “God’s works.” Our backs are continually bent in obedience to God. In light of this, the reaction is not surprising when someone comes along and says that God is Here, Now, always has been and will eternally be, and that you do not have to search for Him. You cannot accept it.
As you know that is what I and others say, but even in this, there is a small “fudge factor.” I say “He” and “God,” only because that is the language people use; but I do not See God as “God,” nor do I See God as “Him.” I only use these terms for understandability. God Is. This is the extent of it. God is not separate, and if one looks through the eyes of clarity one can see this; but if one looks through the eyes of conditioning it is not seen. Now, when you look for God, you usually look for a feeling. These are associated with the concept of good, i.e. “God is good”. You have expectations around the concept of God. A “God expectation” is programmed into you. So you expect that good feelings will be associated with God and bad feelings won’t. If someone like me says to you that God is not good, your mind rejects this because of centuries of conditioning. It is a given in the world that God is good. Yet the very concept “good” is just a belief and has no more validity than the concept “bad.” And here we come to the crux of the matter and that is - duality.
The core of duality is God and me. This started with the development of the brain. Duality began when the first humans had a thought and that thought was, “me and not me,” “you and me.” Imagine yourself at the dawn of man. There is nothing. Then there is. With the introduction of something, separation began. But this separation was/is not real. Of course if does no good for you to be told that, because it is real for you –
what is said sounds only like a theory or a possibility. You are separate from me. And you will continue to hold God separate from you until such time as I am no longer separate from you.
All of the accepted RS teachings in the world are founded upon the idea that God is One. All devout followers give lip service to this but their experience is not that All is One. Rather, their experience is that all is separate. Yet they want to believe that all is one and so they embark upon a search to find the “secret” to this experience.
All RS organizations promise this secret, yet few find it. And what is the reason that so few find the secret of the “return to God”? Is it the organization’s fault? Is it the sacred book’s fault? No, it is always the seeker’s fault. He hasn’t been diligent enough, or he hasn’t practiced as he should. And even if he were to do everything right, what is he promised? He is promised that something will be different. His life will get better or he will go to heaven. And what does this imply?
It implies that whatever is going on now is not good enough. It implies that the life you are living can get better. After centuries of this belief, the actual DNA or structure of humankind changes and incorporates this belief into the essence of humanity, so that it no longer merely “has” this belief - humanity is this belief. Beliefs are ingrained into people just as physical elements of the body are modified in time. Examples of physical modifications are the shape of the head, the elimination of a tail, the disappearance of webs between the fingers and toes, etc.
In essence, there is no hope for humankind to once again Realize who they are using the only method they have at their disposal - the intellect. But does that mean that there is no hope for Self-Realization? Not at all, but it takes tremendous courage to break with all that you think you are. You are not a human being. You have no “relationship” with God. Love, as you know it is a lie. It is not a malicious lie; no one is at fault except that after centuries of our ancestors, a laziness has set in, a sleeping and a willingness to be told what the truth is as opposed to discovering it for oneself. To discover Truth for oneself, one places oneself outside of society and culture. Not because one wants to but because that is where one ends up. Very few will understand you. Very few will listen. Many will attack because you scare them. Many will laugh. But none of this matters – none of it! And this post won’t make sense to many. It need not, but for maybe one or two it will spark something. I’ve gone on long enough. And we have not even scratched the surface!
EM: I don’t see how me thinking/feeling/knowing I exist “proves” that there is only one of us.... it just does not compute. So what if I think I exist – that hardly proves that other people do not exist as separate entities. You’re going to have to do better than that old man. :))))))
Wayne: It will never be good enough. It is not up to me to prove anything to anyone. To ask more of me is to leave me and to search for a better answer. Either take what I say as True or don’t. Our relationship depends upon the (seeming) choice you make. What I say is not good enough for many and so they seek a better answer. Isn’t this the same old story? All I have here are words; but in person we share silence, and then it is Known. But perhaps this will help: you are aware of silence are you not? So am I. That is where we meet.
EM: It can be difficult to say peace is peace without giving some sort of description, an analogous mind-candy experience of peace ... It’s like we want to be given signs and say “this is what you will feel, this is what you will experience”... but is it? I think in general this is what confuses many.
Wayne: I agree that any description or attempted description can be confusing. One of the reasons for this List is that the people who are here and those to come are “generous” in their listening: they know that we will never be completely successful in our explanation. This is opposed to a list that is devoted to understanding a particular religious path. My experience is that the listening on those lists in not particularly generous, because everything is referenced from the path; in other words if what one says does not jibe with the path or dogma it is rejected or negatively questioned.
Here we come from no path or fixed belief. Our/my only reference is Peace and since Peace has no attributes I must find examples, imperfect as they may be, to be able to speak at all. Granted, much of what we say can be found in various paths, and generally we are coming from a place of respect for what someone is considering.
EM: There are no signs to speak of and if there are, then we step into the arena of the “way” and the “word” again.
Wayne: Yes. And once we/I begin to tell people that my way is the only way it is time to close up shop. I think that it is impossible to have a “way” or path from where my/our focus is. If we were so bold as to start up the “Church of Peace” I don’t know what we would sing about or what the sermons would be like. Let’s see how a sermon might start out ....
Good morning ladies and gentlemen. This morning I want to speak about nothing, no thing at all.
Herman pass the collection plates.
(As the plates are coming around we will all sing, “I got plenty of nothin...”)
EM: The only problem is that my mind wants to turn even being nothing into something special.
Wayne: Good insight. Now here’s one I would only give to someone who is really seriously looking…look at the absence of absence in your life. This is what is lacking for EM. There is no such thing as absence for EM, there is only something missing. And that is why the search begins and continues.
For the Teacher there is only the Presence of absence.
If you can see what I am pointing to, you will take a big leap towards Self-Realization.
EM: Wayne, I printed this out and took it with me to look at while having a few at lunch…you wrote “…look at the absence of absence in your life.” By this I’m assuming you mean the absence of nothingness, the absence of void, the absence of emptiness and I’m assuming also that’s what you mean by “no thing” being something or anything that fills the void (physical or mental). Like anytime we do something or think about something just to occupy ourselves, always being preoccupied with some THING internally or externally never leaving ANY Quiet Stillness of Nothing going on.
Wayne: Yes, EM rejects Stillness. It is what it is afraid of. It is afraid that the Stillness might be what it is headed for. And it is correct. :))
EM: You wrote, “ This is what is lacking for EM.” Do you mean this is what EM needs (i.e., EM needs the presence of Nothing) or that EM sees the absence as a LACK in a bad sense, like EM seeing/sensing the absence/void as a bad thing that needs to be filled, filled with any THING good or bad as long as it’s some THING and not nothing.
Wayne: EM is afraid of Stillness. I know people who must have a radio or TV or music on all the time until they drop off to sleep. The go for a walk with their walkman or with a companion and talk all the time. They are never Still voluntarily.
EM: This brings to mind something I hear a lot about in AA, that is talk about this empty pit or void so many feel inside and how life became about filling that pit/void, which was later found to be a bottomless pit putting them there in AA. But something I’ve began to wonder about the last few months is what if we ARE that PIT/VOID that we have been running away from our whole life.
Wayne: Yes, that “pit/void” is what you are in Truth, and what you are running from.
EM: I mentioned this in the last meeting I attended and people looked at me as if I were crazy. I also assume this is what is meant by “There is no such thing as absence for EM, there is only something missing. And that is why the search begins and continues.” In other words, you are saying, EM is activity itself, it can never be quiet/still/empty.
Wayne: Yes, EM cannot be Still. There is no way to make EM become quiet. You cannot make yourself better. So now what? :)) So I say, stop trying to make EM (yourself) find Stillness, pay attention to the Stillness that is already here. Pay attention to the Stillness that is present even when EM is listening to noise, even when EM is talking or listening to the radio or arguing or angry. The Stillness that is always present has not gone anywhere. It’s all a matter of focus, but it is not EM that does the focusing.
EM: Now when you say “For the Teacher there is only the Presence of absence. If you can see what I am pointing to…” I know this is only words and words are not IT, BUT, as I see it, you are pointing to that still/quiet/empty/void.
Wayne: Yes I am.
EM: What I don’t have experiential understanding of is ONLY that absence/void being present.
Wayne: No you don’t, it is impossible to “understand” Stillness. How could anyone understand it. So it is in fact an “experience,” but it is not an experience for EM, it is what is called the “essential experience.” And I, 100% guarantee that you have had this experience. I Know you have beyond a shadow of a doubt. Of course, if I am just some guy who comes up with some good ideas now and then, you will not Hear what I am saying, but if you Trust me fully then you Know I am Speaking Truth here. You could not speak and ask questions the way you have without having had the essential experience. But where you are looking to remember this experience is in EM and it cannot be found there.
EM: I’m sure it has BRIEFLY come to the forefront of my awareness.
Wayne: Yes, there you see, you do Know it.
EM: BUT, how come it’s not naturally appealing, if it’s our true Self?
Wayne: It IS appealing, so appealing that you are afraid of it. Have you ever looked over the edge of a cliff and felt the rush? Stillness is what has been calling you since you were born. But since EM equates Stillness with death and since you listen to EM, you are afraid of that, which you are seeking. You are running from what you want, more than anything else, Peace. But the way EM has it, is that Peace is death, so it keeps the racket going.
EM: Wayne, there must be some appeal, and if there is, how come I don’t see it, if this is who we really, really are, I would think that there would be a natural appeal of some kind? Which also begs the question, why was it (this natural empty/void self) so easily covered up, over looked, ignored for so long as to seem nonexistent.
Wayne: Now perhaps you may be able to see that all of your questions are coming from EM. EM wants to know how the impossible happened. :)) The impossible did not happen. That is why this is an illusion/dream. Here’s something else; You aren’t taken in by any of this because belief in anything is nonsense – except to EM whose very existence is dependent upon beliefs. (I am Speaking to you directly, on two levels, and you will get this when you least expect it.)
EM: What is it that is so appealing and seductive about EM that we would choose it over the natural Self?
Wayne: Did you ever play hide and seek as a child? Fun wasn’t it? But
perhaps you may have missed something…it was played so that you could eventually be found. The fun is in the finding. That is what the spiritual search is all about, finding your TrueSelf. That is all that is going on.
EM: I’m just frustrated sitting here stirring in my own shit, my self-made conundrum, I think I just prefer ANYTHING over nothing, don’t you?
Wayne: Sometimes I like to play too. It’s fun when you Know how it all ends. :))
EM: What’s the point of living if not to experience something, I mean when we die, I bet you we go right back to that Ocean of No Thing. What if the only point of living was to experience the duality of life?
Wayne: To live and to experience yourself as two is not a bad idea. Aren’t you glad you had that thought? :)))
EM: Thank you Wayne for reaching out to me, it really warmed my heart, and I may not sound like it, but I do FULLY trust you or I should say something in me trusts you completely, I just know you KNOW. I don’t know what else to say.
Wayne: You said it beautifully, Thank you.
EM: There was so much in this response of yours that spoke directly to the Heart. As I read your words, I keep getting that eerily familiar feeling….It’s like a long time ago, I realized that I would forget about something very important and so I wrote myself a bunch of notes to remind myself about it. And now I am finding those notes that I left for myself, and what a strange feeling! Like I’m leaving a trail of breadcrumbs and walking in a big circle! HAHAHA!
Wayne: “A trail of breadcrumbs,” what a great description! Yes, you are remembering what you forgot. And you forgot the Truth of who you are, in order to do the story. But you are waking up from the dream….
EM: Many moons ago you said it was not possible to experience the nothingness, and I wanted to kick you then. :))) Isn’t this the worst news that EM could ever hear? I mean, all of its searching and arguing and discussing, and eating of dry crackers, and drinking of stale wine, and sore
knees from praying for relief, and giving to the poor in order to be “good,” and fear for ones life and all of this and more….you mean to say there’s nothing I (EM) can do about it????!!!! This has to be some sort of big fucking joke, right?
Wayne: RIIIIGHT!! :)))))) Welcome to Fantasy Land. Apparently, you didn’t notice that you were in it. :) But you were the one who voluntarily closed your eyes at the entrance so you wouldn’t See. :)) But I’m glad to help you remove the blindfold, if you should ask . And I’m sure you understand that most people want to keep the spiritual blindfold on because they don’t want o look at what’s happening…nothing. :))))